Tennis EquipmentTennis Strings

Natural Gut Strings – The Best Tennis String Available?

What is natural gut tennis string made from? How is it made? Who uses it? Find out in my in depth guide

First invented in 1875 by Pierre Babolat, the same year that the Marylebone Cricket Club's 1875 Rules of Lawn Tennis had been drawn, natural gut is one of the oldest tennis string types on the planet.

To this day it remains one of the most frequently used strings on the pro tour despite that fact polyester and other synthetic strings have entered the market.

So why are they still used? How is natural gut made? What characteristics does it have and which companies produce the best natural gut string today? Let's take a look.

Where Did Natural Gut Originate?


Pierre Babolat manufactured the first set of natural gut tennis strings in 1875. Babolat was in the musical instrument business making strings for cellos, violins and other string instruments.

He was approached by a man called Walter Clopton Wingfield, one of the pioneers of the modern game of tennis. Wingfield asked him to produce strings for his new sport called โ€œSphairistikeโ€.

Babolat took up the task, producing a string made from sheep's gut and Babolat as a racquet string company was born.

From there, sales took off as the sport grew and in 1925 Babolat launched the VS string which was used by Rene Lacoste during his French Open and Wimbledon wins that year.

What is Natural Gut Tennis String Made From?


Although Babolat's first incarnation of natural gut string for a tennis racquet was made from sheep's gut, it was quickly decided that a cow's intestine (the serosa) was the better choice.

The primary reason here is that the tensile strength and length of sheep gut doesn't perform as well when compared to a cow. This was the case even back then and is even more apparent in the modern game as racquets require more string due to bigger head sizes, and more tensile strength because of how hard players hit the ball.

Fun fact: the serosa is only a small part of the intestine and it takes about three cows to produce one set of tennis string.

If you have ever purchased natural gut strings, you'll know that quality control can vary depending on the manufacturer. Different breeds of cows are better suited to producing higher quality strings and also the region + diet of the cattle can all impact the performance and quality of the end product.

One theory is that cows raised and fed in pastures have tougher intestines compared to corn-fed cows. It's believed that the intestinal material is stronger to deal with the impurities in the soil.

What Makes Natural Gut so Special as a Tennis String?

natural gut special

It's the molecular makeup of natural gut that makes it ideal for tennis. Within the serosa, the collagen's molecular makeup can withstand the stretching and contraction of the intestine.

Without getting too scientific, the collagen of a cow serosa is made of a triple helix molecular structure. If you think of a braided rope made from three strands of cord, this is the same design.

The braided composition provides elasticity but also gives a cushioning effect. The result is that a natural gut tennis string produces both power, thanks to its elasticity when under tension in a strung racquet, but it is also very easy on the arm when compared to some of the modern harsher strings like polyester or kevlar.

If you have ever played with a natural gut strung at 55lbs+ and then played with a nylon or polyester at the same tension, you'll immediately notice that the latter plays with a stiffer and less forgiving stringbed when compared to natural gut. That's why it's the arm friendliest string available and used commonly by senior players or those suffering from tennis elbow.

Does Natural Gut Provide Any Advantages When it Comes to Playability?

natural gut advantages

Because natural gut plays softer than its counterparts that translates into increased playability due to the dwell time of the ball on the strings.

This is often called โ€˜ball pocketing' amongst players and refers to how long the ball is in contact with the strings. With ball pocketing increasing on gut strings, many players find that this leads to a greater sense of control of the ball. The added feel of natural gut means players feel more connected to what is happening with the ball as they make contact; boosting the player's confidence when hitting full-blooded shots or when a deftness of touch is required.

Natural gut tennis string also holds tension better than synthetic strings are able to. For example, if you string with polyester, the string is mostly dead after a few hours of play; natural gut, on the other hand, remains playable for the duration of its life.

For players who don't break strings often, they may find natural gut to be a better value than synthetic strings despite the higher upfront costs. Rather than having to cut out and replace dead strings, a racquet strung with a high-quality natural gut can play with the string until it breaks.

In summary, natural gut has the following advantages:

  • Power
  • Tension maintenance
  • Arm friendliness/comfort
  • Feel

Are there any Downsides to Natural Gut?

natural gut downsides

Even though for a large number of players natural gut is the holy grail of tennis strings, no string is perfect and depending on your game style then it can have a couple of disadvantages.

The first is that generating topspin is harder when using natural gut string when compared to polyester. That's one of the big changes in the modern game with poly's making wicked levels of spin possible and is why gut is frequently combined with polyester strings to form a hybrid setup to give the best of both worlds.

Limited durability is another downside and if you're an aggressive player with heavy topspin, you will burn through gut strings in a short space of time. Once the strings begin to fray, they get even spongier, so control becomes an issue. String savers and a denser 18 x 20 string pattern are ways to negate that problem, but eventually, the strings will need frequently adjusting between points.

From my experience, while natural gut isn't as durable as polyester or Kevlar strings, it is comparable to most other synthetic strings and for flatter hitters, durability never really comes into question.

In summary, the downsides of natural gut are:

  • High price tag
  • High maintenance
  • Low durability

What is the Coating on Natural Gut String?

natural gut colour coating

The earlier iterations of natural gut string were susceptible to the elements. If your string got wet, then the strings were essentially ruined.

This meant using gut in humid climates or where rain showers were frequent then moisture penetrating the string, rendered them unplayable. However, modern gut strings are now coated with a protective layer, usually a poly resin, to prevent moisture ingress and weather damage.

Whilst this coating does prevent problems, you still need to avoid moisture and it does eventually wear off, exposing the gut underneath and you'll notice fraying when the coating is no longer present.

Manufacturers of natural gut are also working to improve durability by tweaking their processes, Babolat, for example, has introduced a line called Thermogut which is a heat treatment designed to increase the cohesion of the gut fibres.

How to Care for your Natural Gut Tennis Strings

carnauba wax

To further prolong the playable life of your string, you can apply a wax to the strings after play. This is a good idea in humid climates as it helps keep moisture out.

It's also worth cleaning the strings down with a cloth before applying the wax as this helps reduce friction and notching between strings.

If you play on clay on, for example, grit lodged between the strings can increase friction. Friction creates notches on the surface of the string, leading to premature breakage.

I recommend trying out a Carnauba car wax. By reapplying a protective lubricant, this further protects against water. The results in an increase in string durability and is worth the extra hassle based on my own testing.

Some stringers also use baby oil during and when they have finished stringing the racquet with the theory being it stops the strings drying out as much. I haven't tried it but if you have a bottle to hand it might be worth a go. 

The other consideration is storage; you want to store your racquet in an area that's not damp but not overly dry either. Don't leave your racquet in a hot car when not in use, and this ruins the strings. The ideal temperature is your standard room temperature around 17-20 degrees Celcius.

Finally, you may also want to look into string savers. They are small pieces of plastic that slide between the strings and decrease friction and prolong string life.

How is Natural Gut Tennis String Manufactured?

natural gut string

Producing natural gut string is a lengthy and hands-on process, which is why it's the most expensive tennis string on the market.

When the serosa has been removed from the cow, it's cut into long ribbons. The serosa ribbons then go through a lengthy wet cleaning process. This is bathing the ribbons to remove impurities without harming the collagen gently. Some manufacturers also use a light bleaching process to remove some of the orange colour.

One the serosa has been washed, they then undergo a thorough quality control to ensure they are up to scratch. It is also at this stage that different colours can be added, which is why you can see red, black and other coloured natural gut on the market.

If the ribbons pass through quality control, they are bound together in tension racks and are left to dry. The drying process is a lengthy process that takes several days and is done in a climate-controlled room for consistency. 

Once dry, the ribbons finally start to look like string, but the outer surface needs to be smoothed and polished. It is then checked to make sure it meets the correct gauge specifications. At this point in the process, most manufacturers will conduct another quality control check and coat the string with a special polyurethane coating to improve abrasion and water resistance.

Back in the day, some players were known to request string without the protection of a PU coating as they preferred the extra performance, in this case, the string was wiped down with a light coating of coconut oil.

Finally, the string is prepared for it's packaging whether it's a reel or in a single pack.

For a visual take on the process, take a look at the video below:


Tips for Stringing a Tennis Racquet with Natural Gut String

Stringing Tennis Racquets for Beginners

When it comes to stringing natural gut it's the type of string that requires proper care and attention. I wouldn't say it's hard to string but you need to be on the ball to prevent kinks and too much friction when weaving crosses.

Based on my experience, the key for stringing with gut is to take your time and do it when you have ample time to spend stringing. While you can often rush a poly string job and it turns out a-ok, rushing with gut can produce an inferior result. A few other tips to avoid some of the more common mistakes when stringing natural gut I've picked up along the way are:

Before starting:

Check your grommets to make sure they're in good condition and not misshapen. Over time grommets get worn and out of shape due to the tension. Rough or sharp edges can damage gut easily when you pull it through the hole. If your grommets have seen better days, consider replacing them.

Make sure you're careful when uncoiling the natural gut from its packaging to prevent any kinks. To further lessen the chance of kinks, I recommend pre-stretching gut string. While not essential it does help with tension maintenance and if it's part of Roger Federer's string setup, then why not? ๐Ÿ™‚ To do it you'll need to loop the string around a door handle for example and pull it in a straight line. Try to avoid wrapping it around objects, you ideally want to have the middle of the string looped onto a smooth rounded object then pull on each cut end with your body weight.

The next tip before even commencing stringing is to make sure your clamps aren't set too tight. If you clamp gut too tight, then it can damage the fibres so you want the clamp to hold the string firmly, so it doesn't slip but not the point you can teeth marks from the clamp or squashing. The best way to test this is to clamp an offcut of the gut and see how it impacts the string.

During stringing:

Stringing the mains is never a problem, but the crosses require a little more care as you can generate too much friction and easily notch the string when weaving. The video below shows you how to counter that problem:

I also recommend taking care on some of the more acute holes and when stringing near the clamps, which can cause holes to be harder to string depending on which machine you are using. This helps to avoid kinking or wear on the strings.

What is the Best Natural Gut Tennis String?

babolat vs team

Although it all looks the same, not all natural gut is of the same quality and depending on the manufacturer and the processes used, the shift in quality and playability can be dramatic.

Generally speaking, the main brands like Babolat and Volkl produce the top quality stuff but there are some smaller manufacturers like Wholesale Natural Gut who seem to receive good feedback across the wider tennis community.

The most expensive gut strings have to meet strict guidelines from the manufacturer, for example, Babolat's premium VS Team product is their flagship product and widely regarded as the best gut string out there. 

As you'd expect, VS Team carries a premium price tag, so Babolat, along with most other gut manufacturers, stock a second line of string that might have slight inconsistencies in gauge and colour.

Babolat's cheaper variant is called Tonic+  and whilst still a high-quality natural gut, it does not meet the exact gauge and cosmetic requirements of VS Team.

With that being said, if you stick with the main brands, then you can't go too far wrong no matter what string you use. Hop on the popular tennis forums, and you'll see player favourites from Babolat, Wilson, Pacific, Klip, Volkl and Luxilon. I've listed my three top picks below.

My Top 3 Natural Gut Strings for 2020

Even though gut is still widely used on the pro tour and has stood the test of time, the market isn't flooded with choice. This is primarily due to the tricky manufacturing process, but the good news is the brands that are producing it in 2019 are top quality.

Rank String Price  
#1 Babolat VS Team ~$55 Check Price
#2 Wilson Natural Gut ~$45 Check Price
#3 Volkl V-icon ~$30 Check Price

Babolat VS Team

babolat vs team

Check Latest Price

Babolat's top of the line Natural Gut is the VS Team Variant. The VS Team is only made in 17 gauge and is used by a number of touring pros on the ATP and WTA tour.

The string has been around for decades but now includes Thermogut Technology โ€“ a process of high-temperature finishing that increases the cohesion of the string fibres.

Babolat also used their BT7 technology, which is a new layering structure, which is said to increase durability by 15%, and this is the benchmark string for comfort and playability.

If you want a slightly thicker gauge string that is slightly more durable, then take a look at VS Touch by Babolat which is made in two gauges โ€“ 16 (1.30 cm) and 15L (1.35 cm). I personally prefer the Team VS, but if you break it too fast or it wears out too quickly you could try the VS Touch either as a full bed or in a hybrid setup with VS Team

Professional players who use Babolat Natural Gut

  • Dominic Thiem
  • Marin Cilic
  • Novak Djokovic
  • Kevin Anderson
  • Andy Murray
  • Johanna Konta

Wilson Natural Gut

wilson natural gut

Check Latest Price

Best known for being the racquet brand of choice for champions like Sampras, Federer and Serena Wiliams, Wilson also have their own string and their natural gut uses only top quality beef serosa to produce one of the most popular gut strings on the market.

How does it differ from Babolat VS Team or VS Touch? The answer is not a lot. In fact, it's long been rumoured Babolat actually manufactures Wilson's Gut String and lets them put it in their own packaging. Many years ago a poster on the Tennis Warehouse Forums claimed to have opened a Wilson pack of string, and the string said Babolat on it ๐Ÿ˜†

Some players believe Wilson's gut is slightly softer as it's not treated with Thermogut like Babolat's VS. Again this is up for debate with other players thinking it's identical. I prefer the Babolat string but I've bought many packs of Wilson Champion's Choice over the years and it's always been good to use.

Professional players using Wilson Natural Gut Variants

  • Kei Nishikori
  • Roger Federer
  • Serena Williams
  • Juan Martin Del Potro
  • Grigor Dimitrov
  • Phillip Kohlschreiber

Volk V-icon

volkl vicon

Check Latest Price

Volkl is a German brand known for producing some of the most arm friendly racquets on the market that are ideal for senior players or those with tennis elbow. So it's only fitting that an arm friendly string would make its way into their product lineup and the V-Icon is just that.

The V Icon comes in slightly cheaper than the string offered by Wilson and Babolat and when playtested it's said to provide a crisper feeling than other natural gut strings on the market. 

Players using Volkl V Icon Natural Gut

  • Unknown


Expensive? Yes. But all things considered, natural gut will play better longer than almost any other string material and if you haven't ever tried it out then give it a go!

Have you played with natural gut strings? What do you think about them? If you have any comments, questions or feedback feel free to leave them below.


Huge fan of Roger Federer. I watch all his matches from Grand Slam level right down to ATP 250. When I'm not watching or writing about tennis I play regularly myself and have a keen interest in tactics, equipment and technicalties of the sport.

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  1. Oh, yeah, now my mouth is watering! Decathlon sells Babolat VS Touch for 36 โ‚ฌ a set plus 5 โ‚ฌ for the handwork.
    I have just to pick the right racquet to put it. Damn, if only I were sensible enough to have just one pair of matched racquets. Wait… I have 2 PD, but to put gut on those frame is not something very orthodox…

    1. Nice that’s a good price. 5 euros for a string job is great too, whoever is charging that is selling themselves a bit short!

      Is PD Pure Drive? Thiem has gut in his pure strike.

      1. No more. He changed this year (I think, just before Hamburg) to string srtuip without natural.

  2. One day I will test it (and never come back to synthetic, maybe).
    ยฟWhy Federer uses natural gut in the mains and polyester in the crosses?

      1. Thiem was using hybrid over years but started to use synthetic strings this years and says, this string setup suits him better than hybrid. So, it’s very individual.

      2. For Thiem or Fed to use all natural gut?

        With how Thiem hits the ball full gut wouldn’t be a good setup for him. Far too powerful. Gut in the crosses for him prob best.

        As for Fed, the same, he needs a poly in the crosses to temper that power of the gut.

      3. @Jon
        Remember Thiem kissing the racket after defeating Nishikori in London 2018? Still using hybrid.. But he experimentally used higher string tension, resulting in less shots going out. Power of his hitting technique and power of low strings tension was too much ๐Ÿ˜‰

  3. After I developed tennis elbow, I was unable to play tennis without pain. My daughter’s tennis coach suggested I try natural gut strings and it made all the difference! I could play pain free again! I had no idea. I love your blog, Jonathan. ๐Ÿ™‚

    1. Tennis elbow is not a fate. It can be healed (in many cases by simple home rehabilitation) and you can protect yourself against it to develop by using compression sleeves.
      Of course using natural gut strings helps, if you have just a tennis elbow or you want to avoid it to develop.
      You can also develop hitting skills, which help to avoid different typical injuries. Ask your coach, if you have one.
      Also a kind of a racket frame and strings tension are important factors.

  4. @Jonathan
    Natural guts and carnauba. Never heard about, but I know that there is a new generation of natural guts (for example VS from Thiem’s – no more actual – hybrid setup with RPM Blast) having added some component during the manufacturing process, to avoid destruction from humidity. These strings don’t even look like natural string. They are probably coated with some humidity barrier.

    1. Carnauba wax is used to polish the fruit on the supermarket to compensate the loss of the original fruit peel waxes during the processing.
      @Jon: yes, itโ€™s Pure Drive. A soft polyester suits this frame quite well.
      @Danielle: tennis elbow seems to be more a consequence of technique than directly from frames/strings… But indirectly, yes: From my little experience, stiffer strings (little energy return) make you hit harder to get the same ball speed as compared to using softer and more elastic strings. You squeeze the handle harder, swing/accelerate the racquet faster and need to brake it harder at the stroke end. This puts a tremendous stress on muscles and tendons. Repeat this 100s of times and you will get a sore shoulder, wrist and arm, to say the least.
      My opinion is that you should practice smoother and slower swings with a slightly heavier racquet. And the most important: prepare on time, not too early, not too late. Donโ€™t snap, flow. (Easier said than done, hahaha!)

    2. @PRF Yes I wrote about the coatings in this post, Babolat use Thermogut and “BT7” to keep out moisture. It works for sure, but wears eventually.

      1. Sorry, Jon, I did overlook this part of your post ๐Ÿ™
        If it wears, should not be a problem if it holds over the match or set (having 5 rackets in the bag and not smashing all the time you don’t run into rackets deficit like Kyrgios ;))

      2. Ye for pros it’s not ever a problem. In fact, I guess some of them may ask for uncoated gut seen as though it’s only being used for a set.

  5. Wow.

    Press conference questions and gut strings questions…

    It is like some strange form of incredible internet-contextualized denial on a massive scale for my broken sports fan heart.

    “Roger did not lose the worst way possible in the most heartbreaking way imaginable. Move along, move along. Press Conference Questions and Gut strings questions. No CPs at 40-15 for what would have been the greatest achievement of his career. Breath in and breath out…Press Conference Questions and Gut strings questions. All is well….”

    It’s not working for me.

    Can’t even imagine trying to care about Tennis still! (Cause I do care).

    Sorry – my fault. I know.

    1. I can’t get over it, I just can’t, it isn’t another loss.
      Not even Jordan Peterson could help me.

    2. Ha!

      Yeah – itโ€™s clean.

      Def can get way too attached for sure.

      Still, I think the follow-up posts are interesting choices on the heels of what I is arguably the most heart-breaking loss of Federerโ€™s career.

      Maybe itโ€™s the English stiff upper lip. To quote a favorite line from a show, a character from the UK protests โ€œIโ€™m not a robot!!! Iโ€™m British!!!!โ€

      I suppose being mostly Irish doesnโ€™t help me recover. And being a giant man-baby.

      I will say of the follow up posts – glad they keep the post on the loss from gathering any more tallies. And they keep this place from being even more overrun by maudlin and depressing cry-fests by people like me dumping on every new post about โ€œarm pit chafing avoidance techniques when serving hikes your shirt up Kyrios style.โ€ (Feel free to use that one when Fed announces his retirement without fear of copyright infringement.)

      So yeah… Iโ€™m good now!! And gut strings are the best!


      1. No intention or reasoning behind the posts tbh. The press conference one was scheduled during Wimbledon after the author gave me a few books to giveaway.

        Natural gut post has been half written for weeks and I’ve sort of been on holiday since the second week of Wimbledon until end of July. Now had the chance to finish it so hit publish.

        Next post Cincy draw ๐Ÿ™‚

  6. Aha, the natural gut is “the most arm friendly string out there” – how come I didn’t realise that?!
    Such a great article in depth. The mountain effect? Hat off to you, Jonathan.

  7. No wonder you moved on so quick from Loss-ageddon.

    Any man who could call 3 dead cows for one racquet-stringing a โ€œfun factโ€ must have a heart made of stone.

    ๐Ÿธ= ๐Ÿ„ ๐Ÿ„ ๐Ÿ„


    ๐Ÿฅฉ ๐Ÿฅฉ ๐Ÿฅฉ ๐Ÿฅฉ ๐Ÿฅฉ ๐Ÿ” ๐Ÿ” ๐Ÿ” ๐Ÿ” ๐Ÿ”

    โ€œFun fact: the serosa is only a small part of the intestine and it takes about three cows to produce one set of tennis string.โ€œ.

    1. Haha apologies to all veganazis in advance.

      No idea how they source the gut. I’m guessing they will have a deal with an abattoir that sells it.

      1. On the end it must a cow.
        I can’t take your apologies, Jon, because I’m vegenazi, not veganazi, it’s even worse.
        Vegenazi principally does not use anything coming from killing animals. But I must confess, I have used for a while natural gut. No excuses ๐Ÿ™ Nobody is peRFect ๐Ÿ˜‰ Well, it’s excuse and it’s bad one. Sorry, cows. I stop immediately using natural guts – following Thierm, who just switched to all-synthetic setup.
        Don’t know his motivation, but he is deeply involved in animal protection a.s.o.
        Sop I’m going to be more Thiem-compatible ๐Ÿ˜‰ My next string setup is definitly all synthetic.

      2. Veganazis, I couldn’t describe it myself.
        The other day in my country some vegans made a scandal about some event… The same people who approves abortions to be legalized and funded by the taxpayers said “animals lives are the same as ours”.
        You can’t get them more stupid than that.

      3. Iโ€™m sure like the Native American Indian of yore, they use every part of the cow, bred strictly for tennis strings, in a productive, life and earth renewing way.

      4. @Alexander
        And what entitles you to think, your life to be a bigger value (for you) than the life of a cow (for a cow)?
        I guess, you are catholic and believe in the superiority of humans over other lives (God’s creatures too, if you are believer).
        If so, let’s kill the whole (renewable and reusable) humanity and another God comes and creates new humanity and … so much is worth your life.
        Abortion? Where the hell did you find, vegetarians or vegans are by definition pro or contra abortion?
        I’m speaking about animals. No abortion there. Abortion is strictly human problem. BTW – I’m strictly for abortion – just because humans are too many and the Earth is not going to be bigger.
        And it’s not animals who abuses humans. It’s the opposite.
        I have a very close contact with different wild animals. I feel and can exchange good emotions with every animal and every plant. Not with every human. Maybe not with any human.
        So I completely accept to be called vegenazi or vegehitler or whatever you want. Thanks to that I must not feel part of humanity and to be responsible for all the human cruelty against every non-human life.

  8. A cow is a renewable resource, synthetic polymers are not. Anyway, with the amount of beef consumed by humans it would be very strange if someone raised cows with the sole purpose of producing tennis strings… they would be much more expensive that what they are.
    That said, each one has the right to eat what he wants and is no oneโ€™s business, just as it is not acceptable to pass moral judgment on the ones (most of the population in fact) who have an omnivore diet. Bear in mind that meat and fish are the best sources of the 20 (number to be confirmed…) amino acids out that our body needs and is unable to synthesize internally. We stopped being vegetarians a few million years ago. Kill to eat? So what? All predators do it. We have been predators ever since we came down from the trees. And if we can find some use for the un-eatable intestines to play some tennis after having eaten all the ribs and sirloin, the better. At least weโ€™ll lose some of the weight!

    1. Nice provocation, Rui. Not sure, how much irony there. I’m since 10 years vegenazi, before 20 years veganazi. I don’t pass moral judgments, because i believe, everyone has individual moral and you decide every day, watching yourself in a mirror, how do you want to live.

      I do assume, if you call cows renewable resource, you have nothing against events like Holocaust and similar, were some other humans handles you as a renewable resource or wants to make you not renewable. Or uses your cadaver (or cadavers of your family and friends) to produce soap, shoes a.s.o. Principally the same model of thinking – recycling.

      You are wrong, when you believe (or know?), we humans are still predators. If you feel to be predator, go to the forest with your teeth and muscles only, kill an animal and eat it fresh. If you do this (regularly), you are predator. I guess, you are not. Your hunting occurs at Tesco or similar, at McDonalds a.s.o.

      Fish WERE valuable source of nutrients for humans long ago. Now it’s the best source of microplastic, human product, killing first fishes and then killing humans eating fishes.

      Amino acids – well, pleas explain me, how my 70 years old body can be still alive and quite healthy and fit, if I’m not delivering it those 20 necessary amino acids, which my body cannot produce itself? My answer is simple (but don’t know if true) – maybe they are not necessary? maybe my body can produce them from my vege diet?

      I hope, you are happy with killing to eat, to play tennis a.s.o. Yes, it’s your business. These days everything is business. Business has no moral. Amen!

      Do you have ever watched this “modern vegan bible”?

      1. @Jon
        No, I don’t eat honey (it’s animal product, isn’t it? just like milk from a cow).
        Avocado, I can, but I don’t like, butternut squash – never seen but of course every kind of squash – these are all plants.

        Or you have some surprise for me? Say, squash is an animal or so ๐Ÿ˜‰

      2. Avocados and butternut squash require intensive bee farming and migratory bee farming to be produced at scale. So unless you grow them yourself, they are off the menu I’m afraid as they exploit bees!

      3. ยฟYou know that plants are also living beings? ยฟAnd for you to eat them, you’re also killing a lot of insects and animals whom feed on those insects?

      4. No provocation intended. Just facts. No living being strives without causing some sort of damage to another. (And please, get your ideas sorted out. Whatโ€™s the point in bringing in the holocaust? I fail to see the connection.)
        I assume you also donโ€™t take antibiotics or slap flies.
        (And no, I wonโ€™t even bother to read that โ€œbibleโ€. I donโ€™t concede the privilege of discussing against dogmatic convictions)

      5. The Holocaust comment was typical PRF ridiculousness. It’s embarrassing to bring something like that up tbh basically trivialising it. I’ll remove comments if it gets mentioned again.

      6. @Jon
        Am I wrong to believe, you have once asked Sid to not use the world “languagenazi” for the same reason, you want now ban the use of the h…. word? Then you use yourself “veganazi” and I take it not as trivializing the Nazi story but an ironic metaphor.
        I didn’t knew about exploiting bees to raise butternut squash, but as I replied before, I don’t eat avocado or said squash for other reasons, so still no problems for me.
        To eat plants being pollinated by bees, bumblebees and other insects is no way abusing these animals, because pollination is not their goal but rather side effect. Farming is another thing – it’s a kind of industrializing animals and abusing them. This is something I can hardly accept but also hardly avoid.
        And yes, I have own garden in the forest and I’m eating a lot of plants you probably don’t know, they are edible and valuable and to have at no cost and no damage to the nature.
        Arguments, I hear often, “you kill lettuce or nettle or dandelion” is obvious abuse and no sense to discuss about.
        Well, this argument just comes later from Alexander. Yes, I’m killing oxygen too.
        If it’s no difference for you,, @Alexander, to “kill” plants or cows, tell me, please, what should I eat (and I mean, every form of life has the right tio live, but I accept what is prescribed by the nature rather than by humans (who are NOT A PART OF THE NATURE).

      7. @Rui
        Nothing wrong with provoking others to think ๐Ÿ™‚
        You don’t need to watch the “bible” if you don’t like to (but how do you know, ypou don’t like it, if you don’t even try?). I’m not a Christ, but I have read the whole Christian Bible and I found there lots of inspiring ideas. My another “bible” is “Walden” from Henry David Thoearu. Maybe this could be interesting for you if you mean, Gary Yourofsky is dogmatic? Every thinking creature is dogmatic, btw. I’m trying not to be. In this context this means, I’m ready to read arguments from authors thinking, veganiosm is false way of life for whatever the reason and being dogmatic the other way, they have some knowledge, convictions and arguments.

      8. @Alexander
        How do I kill insects, when eating plants? I don’t eat plants from industrial agriculture, using chemicals.
        I have lots of insects and animals (mice, rats, asps, spiders, sometimes birds visiting my house. Something called “animal pest” does not exist for me. If so, humans are the only pest on Earth.

      9. Yup, wrong, I’d never say don’t use the word languagenazi or grammarnazi. From what I remember from that convo I said that calling someone a ‘nazi’ specifically, not appended to another word gets thrown around to anyone you disagree with these days which trivialises it.

        Grammarnazi, feminazi etc are somewhat different, more humour based and they do force their beliefs onto you so fairly accurate.

  9. Great article, thanks ! I have bough to test VS Touch, LXN NG 1.30 and Clip NG, so we will see ๐Ÿ™‚

    BUT the main question is now ! :

    Who has birthday today ?!!!! ๐Ÿ™‚ ๐Ÿ™‚

  10. Happy Birthday, Roger! I pray he has moved on from the match “that cannot be named”. Will it affect him in the future?
    Oh, and Felix too.

  11. @Rui
    Nothing wrong with provoking others to think ๐Ÿ™‚
    You don’t need to watch the “bible” if you don’t like to (but how do you know, ypou don’t like it, if you don’t even try?). I’m not a Christ, but I have read the whole Christian Bible and I found there lots of inspiring ideas. My another “bible” is “Walden” from Henry David Thoearu. Maybe this could be interesting for you if you mean, Gary Yourofsky is dogmatic? Every thinking creature is dogmatic, btw. I’m trying not to be. In this context this means, I’m ready to read arguments from authors thinking, veganiosm is false way of life for whatever the reason and being dogmatic the other way, they have some knowledge, convictions and arguments.

  12. Getting back to something nearer the subject in question, what’s this about Roger and Rafa (and J. Melzer) joining the Council?

    1. If The Rog buys residences worth many millions, all over the world are you goping to do the same? Or you are not enough a fan?

      1. I don’t have money for “residences worth many millions”.
        But I do have the money for a cheeseburger!

      1. Read the New Testament. Many orthodox Jews at this time were vegetarians, possibly because of being poor, but Jesus simply didn’t eat the meat, so he was vegetarian in modern sense. What was his motivation? I think, it was respect for every life and imagination, of how people and animals will leave, when paradise comes back to Earth. I cannot tell you by heart, in which Gospel do you find it.

      2. He ate fish.
        Hang on was this post about natural gut strings? It seems to have changed somewhat over the course of the blog ๐Ÿ˜‚

      3. @Tennisfan
        Yes, we would call him today a pescetarian. But in his time fish was understood differently than mammals. And fish was symbolic for early Christs (Saint Peter The Fisher). Fish was also symbolic for Jewish traditional Sabbath (since before Jesus ) and later as fastday (meatlless) meal.

        For his time Jesus was vegetarian.

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